Click to play videoNew Delhi: YSR Congress chief YS Jagan Mohan Reddy has ruled out returning back to the Congress party or joining hands with the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP). Jagan, whose father and former Andhra Pradesh chief minister YS Rajshekhar Reddy was a Congress members for over 30 years, alleged that the party was targeting him and his father's legacy.
He, however, said that he had no problem in any pact with the Congress-led United Progressive Alliance at the Centre. Speaking exclusively to IBN18 Editor-in-Chief Rajdeep Sardesai, Jagan also ruled any deal with the BJP-led National Democratic Alliance at the central level.
Full transcript of the interview:
Rajdeep Sardesai: Joining us now is one of the politicians of the moment, YSR Congress chief Jagan Mohan Reddy who many believe could be the next politician in the line of fire after the Bellary Reddys were targeted on Monday. Jagan Mohan Reddy, is that how you see it? After Janardhana Reddy’s arrest, many believe that you’re next in line, that you’ll be the next to go to jail.
Jagan Mohan Reddy: Basically, as far as Janardhana Reddy’s issue is concerned I think there should be clarity there. Janardhana Reddy happens to be from the BJP, I was a Congress man, and now we have my own party, YSR Congress party. Please do not try and bring both of them together. As far as Janardhana Reddy’s case is concerned, if you have any queries, you should ask the BJP, or you should ask somebody from Karnataka state.
Rajdeep Sardesai: Okay, I know Jagan, you reacted angrily in Parliament when you were asked yesterday to react to the arrest of Janardhana Reddy, but it is believed, the reason why it was asked was that it was believed that during your father’s rule, the Reddys managed to get iron-ore mining contracts in Andhra Pradesh on the Andhra-Karnataka border, that the several thousand acres of land in Kadappa was given to set up a steel plant and the Obulapuram mines were shown as captive mines for this steel plant. So there was a quid pro quo between Janardhana Reddy and the Bellary Reddys and YSR and yourself, which is why the feeling is that you’re next in line.
Jagan Mohan Reddy: Yes, since you have asked all these questions, let me go point by point on these things. As far as Janardhana Reddy’s mines are concerned, it was Chandrababu Naidu who gave Janardhana Reddy the extension of mines, not my father, that’s number one. Number two, Janardhana Reddy coming to our district to set up a steel plant, yes. Our district is a backward district. If that steel plant were to come up in our district, it would provide employment to around 10,000 people. Had my father not persuaded Janardhana Reddy to come over to our district, he would have jolly well put up that plant in his own district in Bellary, or he could have had his own money in his bank account, who could have stopped him? But yes, our interest was that this man, if he were to come to Kadappa, if he were to come to my district, Kadappa is a very backward area.
Rajdeep Sardesai: There were no business interests, are you saying there were no business interests between the Bellary brothers and yourself and your father?
Jagan Mohan Reddy: Absolutely! That’s exactly what I’m trying to say. As far as Janardhana Reddy is concerned, he was asked to come to my district so that our district will prosper in turn by giving around 10,000 jobs to my own people.
Rajdeep Sardesai: So you saw it as a political reason for setting up a steel plant in Kadappa but the CBI sources are saying that they’ve unearthed a multi-crore financial network between the Reddy brothers, yourself, your father, it was a quid pro quo rule or money laundering in which there are people who are part of your Sakshi company who are also close to Janardhana Reddy, this was one big family. Your father in fact apparently went and campaigned for the Bellary Reddys as well or at least supported them.
Jagan Mohan Reddy: All these need corrections. In fact, the CBI probably went head over heels to prove a nexus between Janardhana Reddy and probably me, and probably our companies. They could prove nothing. The fact that they could not prove anything is because there is nothing. Also the most important thing in this whole episode is you need to understand that throwing mud on somebody does not serve anything.
Rajdeep Sardesai: Was no illegal mining allowed in Andhra Pradesh because the fact is that our stories in the past have shown the border between Karnataka and Andhra was being constantly changed to allow these mining leases to take place in Andhra, export the ore through Andhra Pradesh and it is not just in Karnataka, but in Andhra Pradesh too as the CBI suggests that the Reddys were given a free hand when your father was the chief minister.
Jagan Mohan Reddy: Why do you want to bring in a dead man into this whole picture, specially when he is not alive. You know, the chief minister does not supervise the borders. Various agencies, the forest department, what is governed by the Central government is what supervises the borders and there are various agencies. The chief minister is in no way connected with looking into the aspects of what happens at the borders of the mining, what happens in Karnataka state where mining activity takes place, what happens at Andhra borders where people have been allotted mines, what kind of activity they are doing. It’s not the chief minister who actually looks into those details.
Rajdeep Sardesai: Are you saying, therefore, that as far as you are concerned, your father didn’t even campaign ever for the Bellary brothers, they were seen as political opponents, but possibly business partners, is that how you see it or are you saying there were no business dealings, no political dealings at all at any stage with the Bellary Reddys?
Jagan Mohan Reddy: In fact, if there should be a clarification there, I think my father campaigned against Bellary brothers, when they stood for BJP and my father actually went and campaigned for Congress party there. You can verify your records, you can cross check your records there.
Rajdeep Sardesai: Okay, the main thing against you has been that how is it that Jagan has benefited companies which then in return for that bought shares in companies owned by you, this is the broad argument that the CBI is making. They’ve made it with Bharti cement, they’ve made it with Emaar, various companies whom they say invested in companies owned by you in return of which they got various projects, for example, they got port projects, they got specific projects, like the Ramki group promoter, Ayodhya Rami Reddy, Nigama Prasad, founder-promoter of Matrix laboratories bought in Sadoor and Jaagriti shares owned by you in return for which he gets to develop three port projects, that’s what the CBI charges against you are, that you misused your office to benefit specific companies. Your response.
Jagan Mohan Reddy: See the first and the foremost, what the most important thing here is, as far as whatever you’re trying to say, nine years, Chandrababu Naidu was the chief minister of Andhra Pradesh. When he was the chief minister, he gave ports, be it Kakinada, be it Gangavaram, be it Krishnapatnam, he gave lands, be it Emaar, be it IMG, be it Belliyarao, blah, blah, blah. For nine years, Chandrababu Naidu followed a certain procedure. And if Chandrababu Naidu had followed a certain procedure, in giving away land, or in giving away ports, or in giving away airports, if he had followed a certain procedure, and if my father was the chief minister of Andhra Pradesh, after Chandrababu Naidu, and if my father exactly followed the same procedure, what Chandrababu Naidu did for 9 years, an if whatever Chandrababu Naidu did was okay, then why is it that somebody can point a finger at what my father did?
Rajdeep Sardesai: Sure because they saying that you got those companies then to invest in companies owned by you and you then sold your shares at a premium and made a lot of money out of it, so there was a clear quid pro quo. Chandrababu Naidu also has to face questions, but in your case they’re saying there was a quid pro quo, that anyone who wanted to invest in all these projects had to invest in companies owned by you.
Jagan Mohan Reddy: See first of all there should be a violation in place. If I had done Rajdeep a favour, that means that I had done Rajdeep an out of the way favour, that is my father, of course, first of all nobody can point a finger at me because I was neither in politics, nor could anybody say that I had gone for even one day to even the Secretariat. Nor could anybody say that I even made a phone call to a minister or a secretary.
Rajdeep Sardesai: But you own these companies.
Jagan Mohan Reddy: If at all the government had done any favour, there should be a rule in place and that rule should have been grossly violated to do a favour to somebody. Only when that rule is violated to do a favour to somebody, you can actually say that somebody is benefited and somebody in-turn has invested in a quid pro quo basis.
Rajdeep Sardesai: Ok, Jagan the point is that it appears that you are the beneficiary because your declared earnings went up by almost 800 per cent in the five years between 2003-04 and 2008-09. From Rs 9 lakh and 19,000 in salary IN 2004, then you go to Rs 77 crores when you declare assets in 2009. Then you fight a by-election, your assets come up to Rs 440 crores. That is when people are asking the question, how did Jagan Reddy become so rich overnight? What’s your answer to that?
Jagan Mohan Reddy: First of all, overnight itself is wrong. Second of all, 2003-04 is not right. 2003-04, Rs 9 lakh is my property is what you are trying to say. That itself is wrong, because I’ll tell you, in 2011 – way before my father became a Chief Minister, we took over a Sandur Power Company. It is a hydro power generating company. This company was worth Rs 140 crore, funded by various financial institutions; five banks I think were funding that project – Rs 140 crore project, 37.5 MW. By the time my father sworn-in as the chief minister on May 23, 2004, 90 per cent of the promoters’ contribution of Rs 40 crores was already chipped in into that project. Within six months after my father was sworn-in as the Chief Minister, that is December 25 same year, the project was actually commissioned.
Rajdeep Sardesai: So you are saying, that you became a businessman even before your father became the chief minister, you had already started making your money before that. The point is that how does Rs 77 crores in 2009 become Rs 440 crores in 2010? How does one person acquire so much of wealth in such a short time?
Jagan Mohan Reddy: In fact it is the other way around. As I spoke to you about the power project, where the facts are actually totally wrong and what I am correcting currently that the facts of that story. Similarly in 2009, when I had actually filed my affidavit to contest the elections, I had certain amount of shares. I was also one of the investors in Bharti Cements along with three other investors i.e. Dalmia Cements, India Cements and Prasad Garu and myself. There are only four investors in Bharti Cements. Then all of us invested in that company and we set up that cement factory. In 2009, whatever you have seen, I had certain amount of shares. In 2010, we sold majority of the stake to VICA. And when these shares were sold, they bought at a certain evaluation. Because of the evaluation that they bought, it actually looks like 77 becoming 365. But actually speaking, my asset has actually come down. And another important thing what everybody should know since we are in public life, this is the most important thing. Infact they are talking about three companies, one is my power company, what I just explained. That this power company of mine, was taken over by me in 2001. And by the time my father sworn-in as the Chief Minister in 2004, 90 per cent of the promoters’ investment was already chipped in and the project was actually commissioned within six months of my father becoming Chief Minister. And as far as this Bharti Cements is concerned, there were three investors other than me – India Cements, Dalmia Cements, Prasad Garu and myself. In these companies if, it were quid pro quo, that these companies that have invested in Bharti Cements what is my company on a quid pro quo basis, then why is it that these companies that is India Cements who actually Rs 90 crores made around Rs 140 crores. And Dalmia Cements, who actually invested some Rs 95 crores, actually made Rs 150 crores. And why is that Prasad Garu, who actually invested Rs 265 crores actually made Rs 550 crores.
Rajdeep Sardesai: Are you saying that you did not sell your shares at a premium to Mauritius-based companies or cement companies, in return for favours that they were given an Andhra Pradesh. You are completely denying that?
Jagan Mohan Reddy: Absolutely! In fact what you need to understand is everybody who invested into these companies actually made money. That itself is a clear indication that there is no quid pro quo involved there. And as far as my paper Sakshi is concerned, it is rated number nine in the country. Sakshi has got ABC figures of 14.5 lakhs per day. Sakshi has got an Indian Readership (IRS) figures of close to 1.4 crores. And this backdrop, a similar vernacular newspaper by the name of ‘Eenadu’. Few months before Sakshi actually went ahead and placed shares to investors, ‘Eenadu’ was valued with Rs 18.5 crores accumulated loss and Sakshi was valued by Deloitt at half the evaluation ‘Eenadu’ was valued at.
Rajdeep Sardesai: But the CBI is claiming that all these investments were made on a quid pro quo in Andhra Pradesh. So that’s the basic charge against you. You are denying it. Let me then come to the political question. You went yesterday and thanked Sushma Swaraj. You are going to the BJP and thanking them. Are we seeing the beginning of a new alliance between Jagan Reddy and the BJP? Is that what your future is? You are becoming so anti-Congress that you are ready today to tie up with the BJP?
Jagan Mohan Reddy: As far as the BJP is concerned, Sushma Swarajji is concerned, I have not yet met her, I will be meeting her today or tomorrow, depending upon when she gives an appointment. As far as Sushma Swaraj is concerned, I have lot of respect for her. The same old Congress party in which my father served for 30 years, after his death, is tainting him. While on the other hand the very BJP party, the very Sushma Swaraj against whom my father fought for 30 years tooth and nail, the same people have openly come forward to speak of the injustice being done. But however, I want to make one point very clear – personally my respect towards Sushma Swaraj has gone up substantially but as a party, BJP stands on a different ideology, we stand on a different ideology. And as a matter of fact, you can take it from me that all these troubles have come to me because I have stuck to my word. I have never budged from my character because I stuck to my word and I am saying the same kind of commitment that never would we tie up with BJP.
Rajdeep Sardesai: Even in a post 2014 scenario? Many believe that if you do well in Andhra Pradesh, you will be part of the NDA. Are you giving an assurance to your voters that you do not want to join the NDA even though you are saying on this programme that you are grateful that Sushma Swaraj stood up in Parliament and supported you and your father, while the Congress you say has betrayed you and your father? Are you saying that in 2014 you will not tie up with the NDA.
Jagan Mohan Reddy: Absolutely! We are not tying up. And I am telling you, mark this word today what I am saying – we are giving this word to the entire community – we will never be tying up with the BJP party at any given juncture.
Rajdeep Sardesai: Pre-poll or post poll ?
Jagan Mohan Reddy: Pre-poll or post poll. Even though, personally I am saying, that my respect towards Sushma Swarajji has gone up substantially.
Rajdeep Sardesai: And on the other hand the Congress? The party, as you say, your father worked for 30 years; which you were an MP for. Is there any possibility Jagan of you tying up with or returning to the Congress in some form or is that relationship over?
Jagan Mohan Reddy: See, as far as the Congress party is concerned, time and again we have been saying just one thing. We are fighting with the Congress party. In the state of Andhra Pradesh, Congress party is rolling and we are in the Opposition. And as far as, if the Gods bless us with the numbers and tying up with any party at the Delhi level, then we have told many a times, we made ourselves very clear that be it Sharad Pawarji, be it Mamata Banerjeeji, be it Mulayam Singhji, be it even Congress party we have absolutely no qualms there. Our interest is the state. We are of the opinion – very clearly and categorically- that why should be the Agriculture Ministry be given to another state, when our farmers are reeling under a drought? When we have the numbers, we will ask for the Agriculture Ministry.
Rajdeep Sardesai: From a UPA Government?
Jagan Mohan Reddy: From a UPA Government or from any other government except the BJP.
Rajdeep Sardesai: Despite the way you are saying the Congress has treated you and your father, you are saying that you are ready to tie up with the Congress and that is your first choice?
Jagan Mohan Reddy: Our interest is the state. Our state should benefit the most. Be it Railway Ministry, be it Agriculture Ministry, be it any project, our interest is the state. Anybody other than the BJP at the Centre is acceptable.
Rajdeep Sardesai: Even though your father’s memory has been tainted as you say. Your father a very good relationship with Sonia Gandhi and the Gandhi family, are you ready today on this programme you are saying that you are still ready to reach out to Sonia Gandhi. Will you still go and meet her when she comes back, will you still say I am ready to return to the Congress? Or is that chapter over?
Jagan Mohan Reddy: See returning back to the Congress is over because it cannot happen. Our interest is the state. As far as the Andhra Pradesh’s state is concerned, they are in the ruling, we are in the Opposition. We are fighting a battle head-on. As far as the Central Government is concerned, when god blesses us with the numbers, when we have the numbers, whenever that happens, other than the BJP anybody there at the helm of affairs is acceptable to us as long as our state interests are protected.
Rajdeep Sardesai: Ok. Your point has been made. I think you have made it as clearly as possible. My final question to you – do you fear today that you will be the next to go to jail? I know that is a very straight and direct way to put it but since there is a case against you and you are battling cases of various scams, the charges are very serious. We have seen Janardhana Reddy go to jail yesterday, we have seen other leaders being targeted. Are you the next target? Are you the next person? Do you fear now the battle has reached the stage where you will go to jail?
Jagan Mohan Reddy: You need to understand one thing very clearly Rajdeep. See are we exactly in a place where we can influence people? We are sitting in the Opposition. People in Delhi were hitting on me are in the ruling. At the state level, people who were hitting me are in the ruling. And I am sitting in the Opposition. So basically I don’t think there would ever be a cause or there ever would be a situation where they would go that far. But, in the eventuality they go that far, let that injustice also be seen by the god. And god in turn would teach these people a lesson.
Rajdeep Sardesai: Ok. Jagan Reddy, thank you very much for joining us and giving us your perspective at a time I know is tough for you and your family which seems to be at the moment on the line of fire. That was Jagan Reddy. He is of course the Congress’ rebel now in Andhra Pradesh. Someone, who many believe, could hold the key to what happens the next time around in the State. The crucial political state of Andhra Pradesh.
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